June 06, 2005

A few timely notes on ATTITUDES TO MUSIC AT WARWICK

Follow-up to Warwick Students Union presents… THE TNC SOUNDSYSTEM from World of Mr Agreeable

Morning all...

As some of you may be aware, on Saturday night we held an event in The Cooler which was radically different from anything else piloted in the Union this year. The original details are posted on the webpage above for anyone who wasn't there or wants to get an idea of what I'm talking about.

Now, one common complaint I hear levelled at the Union is that many events are too similar in terms of music crossover – most people would be hard-pushed to tell you the difference in music policy between Top B, Score! and Skool Dayz, for example. Well here we did something completely different, and for the most part what did we get? People complaining that it was… yep, too unlike all these events.

So my question is this: what is the perpetual obsession with "Cheese" at this place (a bracket of music which is - take it from me - extremely limited in its scope), and why is there such a vehement insistence on only hearing the same set of songs played over and over again? If you went out to a club night anywhere else, would people go and complain to the DJs if they weren't playing a non-stop barrage of Britney and Chesney? I'm interested to know if the same people who complained the other night would do the same to the DJs at Delicatessen, or Ramshackle in Birmingham - both of which are nights which incorporate many elements of Saturday's playlist. For the most part, the music you heard the other night was extremely danceable and perfectly standard for an alternative club night OR STUDENTS UNION in any major city (in fact, by many standards it might be considered quite tame in comparison). Why is it that Warwick has such an aversion to it? Does it - oh, dear lord - does it ultimately all come back to this again?

I realise that the event was originally named 'Party Tunes' and that its direction hadn't been fully finalised when this term's issue of Lowdown was published, so I can forgive anyone who read that and thought it was going to be a night of 70s and 80s music (though in case you didn't notice, there are two seperate events which cover these areas about three times a term...) However, the publicity around campus had advertised what the event would be, and this information was readily available to anyone who wanted it.

Saturday was intended as an experiment in trialling a different type of club night at the Union with a broader music policy, and to be honest it saddens me that so many people felt the need to complain so relentlessly throughout the evening. Perhaps I'm more open-minded in my approach to music, as I've always taken the view that if I haven't heard something, that's a positive rather than a negative thing. However, just to illustrate what we were up against, here are a selection of the "discussions" we had with various people…

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

Disgusted Punter: "This music is shit".
Exasperated DJ: "No, it isn't actually – if you opened your mind a bit you might enjoy yourself".
Punter: "But the event's called Party Tunes".
DJ: "No, it's called Party Tunes presents The TNC Soundsystem".
Punter: "What's that then?"
DJ: "This".
Punter: "Oh. Well, can you play some Queen?"
DJ: "No, that's not what this night is about".
Punter: "But you're being paid to play party music!"
DJ: "No, we're being paid to try something different for the night. And besides, this is party music – just one that doesn't fit your narrow definition".
Punter: "Yeah, well, it's shit".
DJ: "Next!"

[Minor point to bear in mind for future reference: going up to a DJ and simply telling him/her that what they're doing is "shit" is hardly likely to endear them to you or your cause].

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

Punter: "Can't you play some cheese?"
DJ: "No, that's not what the music policy is for tonight".
Punter: "Well what is it then?"
DJ (for the millionth time): "Electroclash, alternative dance, alternative hip-hop, dance-indie, breakbeat, funk and rock'n'roll. Basically just a big mash-up of really cool stuff".
Punter: "But look at the dancefloor, no-one likes this!"
DJ: "Er, are you in fact completely blind?! We've had the dancefloor two-thirds full on what is quite clearly an off-night terms of attendance for a good few hours now".
Punter: "But no-one likes it!"
DJ: "No, you don't like it. You're rather selfishly imposing your own opinion on the people who do".
Punter: "I'm leaving! You've ruined my night!"
DJ: "You'll be missed…"

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

Punter: "Is this the type of music you're going to be playing all evening?"
DJ: "Yes. That's what this night is. It was billed as such on the publicity".
Punter: "Well I don't like it".
DJ: "Well, er… I'm sorry about that but we're not going to change it just to suit your needs!"
Punter: I'm not enjoying myself".
DJ: "Well, er… leave then!"
Punter: "No. I've paid to get in and I'm going to stay. But I don't like it".
DJ: "So you're just going to sit and complain all night then instead of trying to have a good time? That must be terribly fulfilling for you…"

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

Punter (at 1am): "What music are you playing tonight?"
DJ: "Er… the stuff we've been playing for the past three hours".
Punter: "Yeah, but what is it? I can't dance to this" .
DJ: "What?! Do you even have ears?! Feet?! A sense of rhythm?!"
Punter: "I think your music's a bit too cool for me".
DJ: "Er… well I'm, er, sorry about that… I… think…"
Punter: "Can't you play some proper dance music?"
DJ: "You what?! This is the fucking Prodigy, and you just heard The Chemical Brothers! Oh of course, forgive me - they've never contributed anything to the arena of dance music…"

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

And my personal favourite of the night, a lady for whom the concept of self-awareness and/or irony seemed to be notably lacking…

Punter: "Can't you play some good music - like Saturday Night or the Macarena?!" - (then, as the door to the DJ booth closes in her face): "... YMCA?!"

– - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –

A big thankyou to all those who came along with an open mind and had a good time – especially any of you who wandered over to either ask what certain tracks were or to say they really enjoyed themselves, despite it being not quite what they were expecting. One girl who'd complained bitterly at the start of the night even came up at the end and said that she took it all back and that it was the best night of music she'd heard in the Union all year – which goes to show that you are able to enjoy something a bit different if you're prepared to embrace this "difficult" concept.

As I said to all those punters who wanted to know if the event would be happening again, if you enjoyed it then for god's sake, MAKE SOME NOISE. E-mail Gaz Barker (cvo@sunion.warwick.ac.uk) and tell him to pass the feedback onto the Ents Department so that they know the demand is out there. Despite the inevitable whingers trying to spoil it for everyone, James and I had an absolutely great time doing it as it gave us an opportunity to share with you music which you might not have heard before or perhaps wouldn't normally get to hear at the Union.

And so, in inevitable High Fidelity style, here's the playlist for anyone who's curious…

  • Transplants – "Tall Cans In the Air"
  • Gisli – "Go Get 'Em Tiger"
  • MC Lars – "iGeneration"
  • Stompa Phunk – "The Crowd Seems To…"
  • N.E.R.D. – "Lapdance" (Freeform Reform Edit)
  • Tiga – "Hot In Herre"
  • Radiohead – "Idioteque"
  • Bloc Party – "Like Eating Glass"
  • Mclusky – "Lightsabre Cocksucking Blues"
  • The Hives – "A Little More For Little You"
  • Novy vs. Eniac – "Smoke Dis"
  • Alter Ego – "Rocker"
  • Bugz In the Attic – "Booty La La"
  • Peaches – "Set It Off" (Disco Remix)
  • LCD Soundsystem – "Give It Up"
  • The Faint – "Worked Up So Sexual"
  • Le Tigre – "Deceptacon"
  • The Bravery – "An Honest Mistake"
  • Mylo – "Musclecars" (Reform)
  • The Sugarhill Gang – "Apache"
  • Thomas Rusiak feat. Teddybears HTLM - "Hiphopper"
  • Atmosphere – "Trying to Find a Balance"
  • Ignorantz – "Phat Girls"
  • Fallacy & Fusion – "The Ground Breaker"
  • Roots Manuva – "Witness (One Hope)"
  • Blak Twang – "Rotten"
  • Jay-Z – "99 Problems"
  • Dizzee Rascal – "Fix Up, Look Sharp!"
  • Soul Coughing – "Rolling"
  • Alabama 3 – "Woke Up This Morning" (Urban Takeover Mix)
  • Kosheen – "Empty Skies"
  • Audio Bullys – "We Don't Care"
  • Basement Jaxx – "Get Me Off"
  • Felix Da Housecat – "Silver Screen Shower Scene"
  • Green Velvet – "La La Land"
  • Mylo – "Destroy Rock & Roll" (Tom Neville Remix)
  • Mr. T vs. Fat Beats – "How 'Bout This, Sucka?"
  • Kasabian – "Club Foot" (Jagz Kooner Vocal Mix)
  • Bomb the Bass – "Bug Powder Dust"
  • Prodigy – "Hotride" (POJ Remix)
  • The Rakes – "Retreat" (Phones Remix)
  • The Chemical Brothers – "Battle Weapon Number 7"
  • Nirvana – "Lithium" (Medicine 8 Remix)
  • BT feat. M. Doughty – "Never Gonna Come Back Down"
  • Soulwax – "E Talking"
  • Fluke – "Absurd"
  • James Brown – "Get Up (I Feel Like a Sex Machine)"
  • Maceo & The Macks – "Cross the Tracks"
  • Kool & The Gang – "Jungle Boogie"
  • The Killers – "Mr. Brightside" (Jacques Lu Cont's Thin White Duke Mix)
  • The Chemical Brothers – "In Dust We Trust"
  • The Grid – "Shapes of Sleep"
  • Prodigy – "Smack My Bitch Up"
  • Underworld – "Born Slippy"
  • Josh Wink – "Higher State of Consciousness"
  • Kaiser Chiefs – "I Predict a Riot"
  • The Eighties Matchbox B-Line Disaster – "Mister Mental"
  • The Rolling Stones – "Paint It, Black"
  • Dick Dale & His Del-Tones – "Nitro"
  • Elvis Presley – "Such a Night"
  • Danny & The Juniors – "At the Hop"
  • Vitalic – "La Rock 01"
  • LCD Soundsystem – "Daft Punk Is Playing At My House" (Soulwax Shibuya Remix)

- 61 comments by 6 or more people Not publicly viewable

[Skip to the latest comment]
  1. Helen Ryan

    most of that lot i aint heard of but what i have heard of sounds well cool, sounds like a good night, but possibly not as good as eating pizza and watching fatal flying guillotine

    06 Jun 2005, 14:22

  2. Andrew Ingram

    I probably wouldn't have liked that playlist anyway. So I didn't go.

    06 Jun 2005, 14:27

  3. Nick

    That playlist, in all honesty, looks fantastic. Any chance of a similar event before the end of term?? Why oh why must the buffoons at this uni insist on the same old shit, infuriating!

    06 Jun 2005, 14:28

  4. Andrew Ingram

    Whenever I request music i'm told it's too obscure and nobody would like it :(

    06 Jun 2005, 14:33

  5. Carter

    Nick, as I said in the entry – email your representatives in the Union and make your opinions heard. Nothing's going to happen if people stay silent and expect things to just turn up, because if there's no notable demand then the Union isn't going to risk losing money on something that they don't think is financially viable.

    Lest we forget, this was how Crash got going – enough people made enough noise about wanting the event and it got a successful trial run!

    06 Jun 2005, 14:34

  6. Carter

    Andy – That's one of the reasons we wanted to try this out, as a lot of the bands we played on Saturday get asked for all the time but ARE unfortunately too obscure for most people's limited knowledge or tastes.

    However, I would suggest that you go along earlier to events (certainly Crash and Top Banana, and especially Baby B where pretty much anything goes!) and ask for more specialised stuff then, as you've got a much greater chance of it being played when there's less chance of it killing the dancefloor and causing the whingers to rush to the stage…

    06 Jun 2005, 14:49

  7. Shalinee Singh

    Ah yes, like when I got you to play DFA 1979 at Top B (good tune – good album in fact)

    "Electroclash, alternative dance, alternative hip-hop, dance-indie, breakbeat, funk and rock'n'roll. Basically just a big mash-up of really cool stuff" Once again, I will say: FUPPING PROJECT.

    Sorry I wasn't there m'dear, I would've beaten everyone's minds open with sticks.

    What I don't understand is, are all these people going alone? Because I can tolerate just about everything music wise, even if I don't much like it, so long as I'm with a group of friends and we're all out to have some fun. There's no point paying to get in somewhere just so you can have a group moan, life's too short.

    06 Jun 2005, 15:15

  8. Shalinee Singh

    P.S. Soulwax, E-Talking, I'm in that video….I wonder how many times I've said that since it came out… ;)

    06 Jun 2005, 15:17

  9. Anecdote of the night (from the lovely Miss Becky Allen).

    She was on the stage dancing away to 'Get me Off', by the mighty Basement Jaxx. Her friend turns to her and says "god, you loser! You know all the words to this!".

    Miss Allen replies "Of course I fucking do you idiot, it's Basement fucking Jaxx"

    to which friend, suitably chastened, replies "oh yeah – it's great isn't it!"

    Moral of the story children – takes deep breathYOU DON'T HAVE TO KNOW THE NAME OF THE BAND IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO DANCE TO A RECORD….SERIOUSLY….LET YOURSELVES GO A LITTLE BIT! IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, BUT IT STILL HAS A DANCABLE BEAT TO IT…..DANCE TO IT…..FOR GOD'S SAKE DANCE TO IT!!

    06 Jun 2005, 15:22

  10. That playlist looks rather good, I didn't even consider going because I thought it would be a night of cheese, though not having been on campus much in the last week, wouldn't have seen any publicty saying otherwise… :|

    06 Jun 2005, 15:31

  11. damn interent ate my comment. what i said was along the lines of: i'm almost weeping at the goodness i missed; damn these exams! i think my heart may have stopped at the moment i realised you were going out on 'daft punk…' pure genius. consider my email sent to whoever it is i have to send it to. bring on new experiences, new music, and new highs! :: goes off to investigate::

    06 Jun 2005, 15:35

  12. Well Hannah liked it ;o) …

    06 Jun 2005, 15:56

  13. Carter

    Greg That's a real shame, as the people who genuinely appreciated it absolutely made our night. Mind you, the real tragedy is that there's such an overkill of cheese here that you automatically assumed that would be what the night was like.

    To be honest, I'm tempted to hand out Kraft slices at future events for anyone who feels automatically entitled to cheese. That way they can take a bite and experience it for what it is tacky, processed crap which might taste okay for a couple of mouthfuls but then just leaves a rather rank feeling in the mouth and stomach afterwards.

    06 Jun 2005, 16:01

  14. Of course that last comment was a humourous rebuff to the fact that t'internet had printed her comment three times when I last looked. It seems to only be coming up once now…and I look like a fool…damnit

    06 Jun 2005, 16:03

  15. Carter

    Tarbs, I deleted it to save her embarrassment. I will do no such thing for you, you ridiculous man. Haha!

    06 Jun 2005, 16:33

  16. Oh you young rascal Carter

    wwwhhhy I oughta…

    06 Jun 2005, 16:52

  17. I wish I'd gone now. That is an amazing setlist. Probably the widest variety of quality music the Union's seen all year. I don't understand how anybody could be disappointed by that; even people who only like one type of music should have been able to find something they liked. If it happens again I'll be there.

    06 Jun 2005, 18:40

  18. Dean Love

    I think it comes down to selfishness. Practically every person that ever goes to an event would prefer the DJs play just thier favourite songs all night. Myself included. There's nothing wrong with that, it only becomes wrong when you go tell the DJs to do that like you have some divine right.
    In deffernce to the people that went expecting cheese though, when I saw the title in the listings at the start of term (Party Tunes) and that it was on a saturday night during exams, I figured it was a small-scale event as the union wern't expecting many people and would be done with minimal effort to appeal to the most warwick people possible. For this uni that meant I assumed cheese or at best a mini-Top B. So I decided not to go.
    Also was this not the second "Party Tunes" saturday night during the exam period? We're people simply expecting something simmilar to the previous week?

    06 Jun 2005, 18:42

  19. Holly Cruise

    I'm all in favour, albeit somewhat gutted I missed it. Bastarding Spanish exam…

    06 Jun 2005, 18:49

  20. Christopher Christopher, when will you learn?

    Have this it will solve everything link

    06 Jun 2005, 19:45

  21. Dang, that playlist looks pretty special.
    'Higher State of Consciousness' is a tune and a half, as is 'Absurd' top marks.

    And Chris, this might interest you. Then again it might not:
    link

    06 Jun 2005, 20:10

  22. Looks like I'd have either enjoyed that playlist immensely (all the songs I recognise are good) and even if I hadn't enjoyed it I still would have received a musical education akin to a good spanking.

    I didn't even know it was happening because I've been a bit snowed under.

    06 Jun 2005, 21:20

  23. Moz

    Good on you for trying something different Carter, too many people at Warwick have poo taste in music. What Dean said is true, people generallly just wanna hear what they know as a soundtrack to them getting wasted- at a house party in my old flat in Leam, me and a housemate had spent HOURS compiling a playlist covering many genres of music to be played from a PC to the main soundsystem, only to find two people trying to substitute it with Nickelback's debut. Even more disturbing was to find out said crap CD was owned by one of our flat!

    I've done a bit of DJing back here in Manc since graduating and have faced similar comments from punters. Two good examples:

    1) In a club where ROCK bands have been playing all night, and ROCK music has been played since they finished…

    Punter: You got any Usher?

    DJ (my colleague): No. Go away.

    2) At a bar with a Mr Scruff tune being blasted out

    Punter: You got any dance music?

    DJ (me): This IS dance music.

    Punter: Yeah, but you got any PROPER dance?

    DJ: Look of despair, ignores presence of punter

    The majority of people have rubbish taste in music, and I say that happy to agree with accusations of being a music snob!

    06 Jun 2005, 22:17

  24. Really great playlist. The soulwax LCD remix knocks the original into a cocked hat, as any Victorian gentleman in attendance would doubtless have proclaimed.

    07 Jun 2005, 01:28

  25. Damn, that looks awesome. Alas having been thrown out of the union at 4pm, being instructued by security to "go to The Bar" we were under the mistaken impression that the CUSU summer ball would be taking over the entire building, so made no effort to attend…

    07 Jun 2005, 03:45

  26. Well well well Cart – seems like we had the wrong 450 people in the Cooler on Saturday. You guys will all have to keep your ears to the ground for the next one – though given the level of support, we might just invite you all individually!

    07 Jun 2005, 11:28

  27. Funny entry, made me laugh heartily. Even if I was anal enough to hate any music that wasn't the norm, I doubt I'd have the courage to go up and ask the DJ about it. As a general rule, I am afraid of other people, especially other people with the authority to control a crowd.

    07 Jun 2005, 13:02

  28. An Atmosphere track, played in public? Much respect etc

    07 Jun 2005, 13:46

  29. smoke and mirrors

    Doesn't there come that point when you have to just get out more? Accept Warwick for what it is; not only bourgeois in its intake but its construction too. Self-contained and innoculated against the real world by roads around it; an academic ghetto, populated in the majority by inoffensively pleasant people. Which makes people who choose not to fit into that bracket of conformity construct another ghetto of exclusivity within that… Hence the beige post and (as you so melodramatically posted on the offbeat forum) the ensuing 'affair'. Education is a fine thing, but as Warwick demonstrates by its outflux of cunts it is far from the apogee of personal development. Your rather paternal attempt to educate the masses in their musical tastes is disconcerting. Get out of the ghetto and you might see that as much as music is good, that many other real world issues are just as important, whether its by supporting your co-workers in a strike over pensions or debating on a blog that has rather more catholic concerns. Ditch the paternalistic superiority and escape to the real world.

    08 Jun 2005, 15:19

  30. I liked what you said the first time you wrote, now you're just being a bitch. As irony goes, your paternal instincts towards Chris certainly are pretty spectacular. I'm no advocate of the Carter Movement (tm), but he's not doing a great deal wrong here, mi amigo…

    08 Jun 2005, 18:12

  31. I fail to see the link between a strike over pensions and the playlist of a Monday night disco.

    In fact, all of what mr/ms. mirrors appears to have written there is irrelevant gumpf.

    08 Jun 2005, 18:23

  32. Moz

    I'm just wondering if Smoke and Mirrors is named after the excellent RJD2 track of the same name…

    08 Jun 2005, 18:58

  33. Ricky

    Oh my god, that playlist…Good. Fucking. Skills.

    That is all.

    08 Jun 2005, 19:29

  34. smoke and mirrors

    I never said he was doing anything wrong, and although there is some irony here, I would argue the toss that it wasn't that spectacular. I'm not emailing him to check his socks are clean, just replying to his post about the mission he has had for many years, namely to educate people in the musical and cinematic tastes. And I think it's not only pretty boring but pointless too. If you get someone to like The Crocketts or watch some Kiarostami… so what? It's all a bit evangelical and messianic, and I only comment about Chris saying what he thinks, because that's what I think about it.

    And the link between a strike and a disco's playlist is that there isn't one. That was my point, see? A strike has to do with claiming some power as a worker, music in 21st century Britain is about leisure and consumption. No link (unless you're talking about Billy Bragg or The Three Penny Opera). Thinking and discussing things like that can be useful to our everyday material lives. Music can be edifying too, but in a different way.

    08 Jun 2005, 19:35

  35. You like words, maybe you should write a thesaurus or something.

    08 Jun 2005, 20:18

  36. So your point is why listen to music when you could be building barricades?

    08 Jun 2005, 20:53

  37. Holly Cruise

    Sounds like a pretty boring world to me. Why can't we have our pleasures just because there are things in the world which are (on a purely individualistic level) 'more important'?

    By insinuating (which I believe you are doing) that what you consider to be more important issues (and I am not agreeing or disagreeing over pensions strikes here so do not pick me up on this) should be our absolute priority then you are completely failing to understand the vitality of music and film and television. Can you deny that works such as the TV shows of Jimmy McGovern have offered insights for those who have not had them before into major issues like Bloody Sunday (Sunday 2002) or the Liverpool dockers strike (Dockers 1999)? Or how about the impact of the original source of this debate, music. Is Dizzee Rascal's work "about leisure and consumption"? I can't really see it in lines like:

    I can show you where it's at/ First things first get a block 'n' a flat/ Next up get a black hoodie 'n' a hat/ Livin' in the big brothers camera view/ Givin' my axe to the boys in blue

    celebrating leisure or lounging around. Infact most of his work sounds like the pressures of being a young, underclass person today. And what about Hard-Fi for the indie kids or SOAD for the metallers? The thing is that you complain that the media is bland and inoffensive, and that as a result we should not try to educate people about it when in fact you don't seem to realise how powerful it can be which shows that we need to push harder to educate people!

    I am not criticising you personally. The radical austerity of your apparent Protestant work ethic (apologies if you do not identify as Protestant but that is how your attitude appears in a historical sense) cannot work on everyone. And if Carter or others can reach out and make a difference to even one person then it is worth it. Even soldiers deserve leave from the horror of war.

    08 Jun 2005, 22:06

  38. Moz

    I think they meant that listening to and buying music is about leisure and consumption. And as for the Protestant work ethic, has someone been reading Weber? :P

    08 Jun 2005, 22:19

  39. Lins

    you played LCD soundsystem! twice!
    shit. there better be another such event soon. please? before i leave, forever and ever and ever and never see the cooler moving to "daft punk is playing at my house…maaah house"

    x

    08 Jun 2005, 22:50

  40. Holly Cruise

    Yeah but Smokey generalised all 21st century media as leisure and consumption based which is wrong and dangerous (as all generalisations are). In any case I haven't become materialistic and selfish from the result of exposure to J-Lo's ouevre. That's an unwilling exposure mind you.

    And not Weber, per se, more the actual Protestant reformation, Luther and Calvin and million other irritating norks. Not that the Catholics were any less irritating. Bloody European World 1500–1720 exam tomorrow. I'm off now to fail it…

    08 Jun 2005, 23:01

  41. smoke and mirrors

    Protestant work ethic, eh? He he. Very perceptive. But I don't mind if you criticise me.

    In a Cartesian (if its the adjective for Descartes, why not Carter?) I will now flip the topic to say that I was just trying to get people talking about politics in music, rather than Music per se. Which maybe I was… anyway, that does sort of highlight the point that I was making. That there is a world beyond Music as Music.

    I wasn't trying to ban Christmas, though summarising Music as commodity fetish and strikes as the will to power may have over-egged my already stodgy rhetorical pudding. I guess I was, via being a bitch, saying that I think music can become a fetish on this blog. I'm glad enough people went and had a good time, but representing it as a quest to revive the campus doesn't sit right with me. Mostly because music is generally seen as an end in itself: pleasure. And that's good up to a point. But when music, film or anything is rarely talked about in terms beyond personal meaning, I do wonder what the point of discussion is beyond:

    A: I like this.
    B: I don't.
    A: Cunt

    or

    A: I like this.
    B: I do too.
    A: Cool.

    08 Jun 2005, 23:23

  42. Dave Sparrow

    At least you didn't have someone come up and ask for busted!

    Well done on doing something different, it's funny how these people seem to want their favourite (and rubbish) music played EVERY SINGLE NIGHT. I can probably accept a certain amount of arrogance usually, but surely not over the Macarena!

    and ramshackle is pretty kickass

    09 Jun 2005, 11:04

  43. smoke and mirrors

    Forgot I was going to say that people's desire to listen to the same cheese music every night must be some kind of reflection of the bourgeois campus. And their own mental state. No desire to see outside the campus, no desire to stretch imagination. No desire to even tell the difference between consecutive nights out, because they're all the same. Time stands still and people can forget the real world exists and life goes on. That's extreme but it does feel like that sometimes. People in the 'real world' (trite opposition I know) do the same though. Why would people temp in a shit job, and the spend all their money on getting smashed to forget it all, unless they were truly avoiding facing up to something like responsibility or ambition? There not living in the 'real' world either. Damn it, now I'm preaching.

    09 Jun 2005, 11:34

  44. Carter

    Smoke and Mirrors (nice that you've kept yourself safely anonymous, though it's not exactly difficult to figure out who this is…), I'm hardly on some grand quest to educate the masses, just provide something a little different for those people here who are bored of the usual crap. Of COURSE it's piss-weak compared to what's out there in "the real world", but while I'm based here making a living in a bid to fund my own creative ventures, I might as well make the most of what opportunities I'm afforded.

    And while I don't actually see myself as some kind of messianic bastion of high culture (contrary to your belief), this shit IS important. By god, it's fucking important. Yes, it's hardly as earth-shattering as global politics, but music represents the expression of human identity, vitality and emotions in creative form. If you'd prefer that people remained silent and complacent, never contributing anything with the ability to enrich lives in the way music can, so be it. But it's not for me. Yes, it's true that I attribute a lot of importance to it, but that's only because ever since I was a kid music has continually defined and redefined me. It's saved my life and changed my life on numerous occasions – and so if I have the opportunity to share something I'm this passionate about with people, you'd better believe that I'm going to do it. The only reason I get so self-righteous about the lack of interest most people show in the medium is that I personally just find it a real shame that they can't appreciate something that so much passion, energy and love has gone into creating. It's there to be FELT, not just consumed unquestioningly.

    Transmission ends, as I'm starting to sound like a total hippy.

    09 Jun 2005, 11:43

  45. Carter

    (And here's one final point of clarification, in case you missed it the first time: some people temp in crap jobs because there's something else they'd rather be doing in the long haul but they need to make enough money to live on while they work at that other thing. God knows, not everyone wants to sit behind a desk all their life – some would much prefer to do something creative with the ability to affect people instead. Personally that's why I'm still here just plugging away and trying to make a buck – because I DO have major ambitions which unfortunately can't be realised right away and will take time to lay the foundations for. Interesting that you accuse these people of being small-minded when you've just done exactly the same thing yourself in refusing to look past the most superficial explanation…)

    09 Jun 2005, 12:03

  46. smoke and mirrors

    As much as I am trying to bait you a little, I'm not suggesting that people should be silent, though that's easier, and I'm not saying music doesn't touch me and move me in ways that are unique (regretably not as dirty as it sounds). I do think you're sending mixed messages when you're say you're not trying to be messianic, and then say that music has saved your life – and thus it seems you believe it might save others too.

    I find that… well, messianic, because it's incredibly personal and is also not a very inclusive approach. Yes, I have made decisions in my life, hard decisions, because Art reminded me about a way of feeling that I wanted to feel again. It can be a spiritual experience in a dark godless world. But when it's just music this, music that, people are shit, etc. it grates. And maybe you're not like that all the time, just here. But as a reader it's hard to tell. And I say all that because I'm getting what you feel, not unquestioningly consuming it, and I do wonder why you feel all this in the way you do.

    09 Jun 2005, 12:18

  47. smoke and mirrors

    You misunderstood my 'temp' statement – the only targets of that comment are the people who do temp because they have no desire to do anything else, and do spend all their money (and energy and time) getting pissed.
    I noticed with disdain that an entrant for Big Brother's career was described as 'Office Temp'. Not a career. So yes, I totally agree. Temping is a double-edged sword – a great stop gap for people with their eyes on further development, or a sad exploitation of people who just want zero responsibilty or progress and to be paid every week.

    09 Jun 2005, 12:32

  48. Tarbs

    What I don't understand, s&m, is how you can go out of your way to downplay the importance of music and the arts halfway up this page, and yet turn around and express the importance of art in your own life. A good song is like a good flim is like a good book is like a good piece of art is like a good play et cetera ; it truly can affect you in a very profound way. I think berating people who then look to share these songs/films/plays/artworks with other people is just plain wrong. Yes, Carter may sometimes get a little militant in the way he puts things, especially on this blog, but to be honest, when he (and I) are constantly faced with the level of musical aparthy that Warwick seems to breed on a practically daily basis, it's difficult not to think that the 'short sharp shock' of telling them that their musical taste may be awful will bear a lot more fruit than begging them to open their minds, just a chink…

    And as to the relevance of Carter's 'messianic' attempt to bring good musical taste to the world in general:

    1. A major part of being a DJ is to do just that! DJing is not simply about playing the most boring requests that you get every night (though many commercially minded DJs seem to think this is the case – not mentioning any names Luminar…). DJing is about trying to spread your enthusiasm for the music you are playing to the crowd. If you do this through letting them hear a song they may not have thought they wanted to hear, and this is successful, that is the mark of a good DJ.

    2. At the end of the day, there are much much worse things to be doing with your time. Listening to Chesney for one…

    I truly hope that Carter and I get the chance to let the TNC Soundsystem live on. Remember kids, we could be saving your life through the power of music next time ;o)

    09 Jun 2005, 12:40

  49. smoke and mirrors

    I don't think ever down played the importance of music or art. I have been discussing this blog's evangelical zeal towards music, and music to the exclusion of most other things.
    Point taken about being a DJ. I would like to know as much music as Carter and yourself seem to know from what the playlists describe. But I don't want to put all the energy into that because I want to read novels, watch films, read the paper, watch some TV too… so yes, expand my horizons yadda yadda yadda. I do consume what music the media shows me because, I hold my hands up, its just easier. But I do try to try new things within those parameters.

    Anyway, it's not really about me myself, and more about the militant attitude that you describe getting my back up, with precious few non-Music, non-Carter based posts. So maybe I just need to stop reading. After all the blogosphere is big place.

    09 Jun 2005, 12:59

  50. All this emotion's got me reaching for the tissues.

    09 Jun 2005, 14:59

  51. Bashmore

    Well how gutted am i. I didn't go on Saturday fearing it was gonna be a piss poor cheese night, and have in fact missed a pant wettingly awesome playlist. I gotta say i cant get enough of the
    "this music's shit…you should play so and so" comments when DJ'ing, it just makes the job all that more worthwile. That said there's always that nice bit of smug satisfaction when the same whining schmo can then be seen half an hour later dancing to everything…and what was that…it looks like theres a smile on their face.
    Right back to compiling my compilation for "songs to listen to while going to a gig"...god damn High Fidelity
    I just wish i was around next year for this night, as it does sound pretty schweet

    09 Jun 2005, 15:10

  52. Well, I'm a little late to the party, but that playlist looks amazing. LCD, Mylo, Kosheen, Audio Bullys, Jaxx, Prodigy – it's all there! Mr Tarbit, I hope you've got something special planned for the Cooler this Saturday to make up for me missing this…!

    09 Jun 2005, 21:40

  53. Bonio

    I agree. I blame students so-called 'ironically' liking 'cheese' music (though seeing as it is now the musical uniform, in what way is it ironic?) for the tat that dominates the UK music stores. What students should be doing is using the time before they get all corporate and 'told-what-to-do' and have their music tastes dictated by whats sold on-line by tescos, they should be providing the breaths of fresh air that come from liking music that some fat marketing tosser hasn't told you to like.

    I only hope that one day someone can get a MP3 disco sorted out so that the DJs can make use of the internet to get good and interesting music, rather than the guff that they do get.

    At least then we can hear music like the fabulous 'call and response' from california here!

    etc etc!

    10 Jun 2005, 08:59

  54. Hero

    This all just shows how aggressive dull people are. This is why so much of the UK is so bland and crap becuase dulll people think that they have every right to slag off everthing that is outside their shite perception.

    (also its the problem of people trying to shag girls with no music taste – girls have always found skipping around to bland songs holding hands 'funny' men who think its cool actually don't – they are just tryong to impress their stepford wives)

    10 Jun 2005, 09:07

  55. Billy Piper

    You know, I think that's right, when I was at school, all the schoolkids danced to bland 'funny' songs like tom jones and abba and that folk woman Joni mitchell is it? – sometimes we listened to neil diamond who was a 70s man who sang about blue jeans.,

    Students on the other hand were off their boxes listening to Primal Scream and Black Grape and going mental to the Prodigy and getting into stuff that was too out there for chris moyles to like.

    Now I am at uni it is really sad to see that at warwick at least, being cool is being uncool. I sometimes wish I was at a cooler uni where the nights that were popular were really cool outthere music.

    Sometimes I think ents is run by my grown-up sister who has a mortgage and shops in woolworths for home furnishings.

    not very RNR

    10 Jun 2005, 09:12

  56. Nice playlist my DJ-ing friends… if you do personal invites next time let me know!

    10 Jun 2005, 23:36

  57. Rob Glass

    In reply to 'Billy Piper', try going to Crash every other Friday next term to see some 'outthere' music. You won't find any bland ironic cheese there. Ignoring the fact the DJs may secretly like them (Girls Aloud, Cough cough)...

    14 Sep 2005, 17:49

  58. Holly Cruise

    I make no secret about liking Girls Aloud, I'm just not gonna play it at Crash. Sons And Daughters anyone?

    03 Oct 2005, 14:53

  59. Anything except for Reef

    03 Oct 2005, 20:03

  60. Holly Cruise

    Le Tigre, Joe?

    03 Oct 2005, 22:30

  61. Le Tigre so awesome :*)

    04 Oct 2005, 02:56


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